The Anglo/American - Nazi War - The on-going mystery

Ryker of Terra

Ryker of Terra

How would the geopolitical calculus change if at some point after 1960 the A4 decided to move into the rump Soviet Union to stop the bloody civil war there?

What would happen to the territory? Would it all go to the Tsarist Republic, or would West Alaska take some of it? Or would it become some sort of democratic Siberian republic separate from both? How would China fare with the loss of their only 'ally'?
 

Lalli

Ryker of Terra said:
How would the geopolitical calculus change if at some point after 1960 the A4 decided to move into the rump Soviet Union to stop the bloody civil war there?

What would happen to the territory? Would it all go to the Tsarist Republic, or would West Alaska take some of it? Or would it become some sort of democratic Siberian republic separate from both? How would China fare with the loss of their only 'ally'?
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IMO joining to Russia or then becoming independent democratic Republic of Siberia are most likely. USA hardly would want take any more ground there after taking Far Eastern Region (amazing that USA even accepted to take that since it would be poorest region of USA).

Another intresting question is what if A4 would had supported some faction on Chinese Civil War instead them dealing their own shit and leading to rise of the Cabal.
 
Gillan1220

Gillan1220

Lalli said:
Another intresting question is what if A4 would had supported some faction on Chinese Civil War instead them dealing their own shit and leading to rise of the Cabal.
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Since the A4 post-war foreign policy is against dictatorships, genocides, and human rights abuses, I don't think the A4 would be keen on supporting the KMT. Since the KMT was just hopelessly corrupt, incompetent, and even authoritarian, it's fair to say the U.S. and the rest of the A4 would have abandoned them. Or perhaps the A4 would tell Chiang Kai Shek not to be authoritarian or face losing support.

I wonder how the A4 would see Mao Zedong's communist movement. Since communism isn't much feared in this world because the Soviet Union was defeated and reduced to a rump state.

I think because the A4 never chose a faction, that's why the Cabal rose to become the rulers of China.
 

Lalli

Gillan1220 said:
Since the A4 post-war foreign policy is against dictatorships, genocides, and human rights abuses, I don't think the A4 would be keen on supporting the KMT. Since the KMT was just hopelessly corrupt, incompetent, and even authoritarian, it's fair to say the U.S. and the rest of the A4 would have abandoned them. Or perhaps the A4 would tell Chiang Kai Shek not to be authoritarian or face losing support.

I wonder how the A4 would see Mao Zedong's communist movement. Since communism isn't much feared in this world because the Soviet Union was defeated and reduced to a rump state.

I think because the A4 never chose a faction, that's why the Cabal rose to become the rulers of China.
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Actually A4 can relucantely accept dictatorship but them should are pretty light-handed and speciality not wage wars nor commit genocide.

But if KMT seemed problematic A4 might now regret that they allowed that to lost the war since now ther eis something much worse.
 
Gillan1220

Gillan1220

Lalli said:
Actually A4 can relucantely accept dictatorship but them should are pretty light-handed and speciality not wage wars nor commit genocide.

But if KMT seemed problematic A4 might now regret that they allowed that to lost the war since now ther eis something much worse.
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The Cabal makes the KMT corruption look tame. Or even the CCP as the lesser evil.
 

TickTock The Witch's Dead

I’ve been thinking a lot about a post-WWII Africa would like like here.

For one, I could see some leaders in former French colonies try to take on the banner of French civilization since France is basically screwed up. Senegalese president Senghor would make himself a much greater champion for French culture and try to make Dakar the new Paris. I’m imagining Africa being considered the home of French culture instead of France since the latter is completely busted up so badly.

Independence is most likely going to come immediately at the end of the war. I’m pretty sure that everyone is too damn exhausted and the A4 might as well give the colonies immediate independence as a reward for their efforts. The A4 will try to cultivate a healthy partnership with the Africans instead of the OTL neocolonialist relationships by helping to promote stable democratic governance and healthy economies. But I might be too optimistic about it, especially since Africa’s serious dependence on Western aid has been abused greatly in OTL.

I wonder if there’ll be attempts to unite colonies into single nations like OTL Nigeria. A4 could have an incentive to make West Africa one country for example in order to ensure stability in the region. But then again such a state would be so huge and they would rather have smaller separate ones so they’re easier to control.

Pan-Arabism. I have serious mixed thoughts if it’ll ever take off the way it did especially if all Arab colonies gain immediate independence, taking away steam from any Arab nationalist movement. But I do imagine efforts by Arabs to work together for sure. Though I seriously doubt there’ll be an successful pan-Arab state since there’ll be no real incentive for it.
 

Lalli

TickTock The Witch's Dead said:
I’ve been thinking a lot about a post-WWII Africa would like like here.

For one, I could see some leaders in former French colonies try to take on the banner of French civilization since France is basically screwed up. Senegalese president Senghor would make himself a much greater champion for French culture and try to make Dakar the new Paris. I’m imagining Africa being considered the home of French culture instead of France since the latter is completely busted up so badly.

Independence is most likely going to come immediately at the end of the war. I’m pretty sure that everyone is too damn exhausted and the A4 might as well give the colonies immediate independence as a reward for their efforts. The A4 will try to cultivate a healthy partnership with the Africans instead of the OTL neocolonialist relationships by helping to promote stable democratic governance and healthy economies. But I might be too optimistic about it, especially since Africa’s serious dependence on Western aid has been abused greatly in OTL.

I wonder if there’ll be attempts to unite colonies into single nations like OTL Nigeria. A4 could have an incentive to make West Africa one country for example in order to ensure stability in the region. But then again such a state would be so huge and they would rather have smaller separate ones so they’re easier to control.

Pan-Arabism. I have serious mixed thoughts if it’ll ever take off the way it did especially if all Arab colonies gain immediate independence, taking away steam from any Arab nationalist movement. But I do imagine efforts by Arabs to work together for sure. Though I seriously doubt there’ll be an successful pan-Arab state since there’ll be no real incentive for it.
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Without Israel Pan-Arabism hardly is very succesful. It wasn't even in OTL and UAR was really short-lived state altough it was partially Nasser's own fault when he tried make that ratherly Greater Egypt than actual Arab country. And Arabs are anyway pretty diverged unfied closely related dialects and religion. There is not so much chances to do that. And not sure if A4 would approve that.
 

TickTock The Witch's Dead

Lalli said:
Without Israel Pan-Arabism hardly is very succesful. It wasn't even in OTL and UAR was really short-lived state altough it was partially Nasser's own fault when he tried make that ratherly Greater Egypt than actual Arab country. And Arabs are anyway pretty diverged unfied closely related dialects and religion. There is not so much chances to do that. And not sure if A4 would approve that.
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Agreed. Though I do wonder if without the Cold War the Arabs will do a lot better.
 

TickTock The Witch's Dead

Something I wanna wonder: between the defeat of Japan and the restart of WWII, what has been happening to Asia, Africa, the Middle East, Latin America, and anywhere that isn't Europe or North America or Australia or New Zealand? I'm seriously wondering what kinds of deals the A4 nations made to colonies and other Global South governments at the time and how they'll impact them after WWII is finished for good.
 
Gillan1220

Gillan1220

TickTock The Witch's Dead said:
Something I wanna wonder: between the defeat of Japan and the restart of WWII, what has been happening to Asia, Africa, the Middle East, Latin America, and anywhere that isn't Europe or North America or Australia or New Zealand? I'm seriously wondering what kinds of deals the A4 nations made to colonies and other Global South governments at the time and how they'll impact them after WWII is finished for good.
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It was stated some became independent like the Philippines (one year later than OTL) and Vietnam and other French colonies (after France collapsed into a failed state), while others became protectorates of the U.S. and Canada.

Countries like India, Kenya, and Nigeria became independent much later than their OTL counterparts.
 

Orwell

Hey @CalBear, during the warm war to the end of the hot war, how was the issue of domestic abuse in the Third Reich? I do recall that the Nazis preached a hyper masculine nigh sociopathic ideal for men so I'd wager it wouldn't be good.
 

Johannes Parisiensis

Orwell said:
Hey @CalBear, during the warm war to the end of the hot war, how was the issue of domestic abuse in the Third Reich? I do recall that the Nazis preached a hyper masculine nigh sociopathic ideal for men so I'd wager it wouldn't be good.
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Moreover, the war in the East certainly brutalised the veterans: Franz Fanon wrote about the psychological effect of the Algerian war and colonialism he was able to see, and devoted an entire chapter to the issue of policemen torturing their families after having tortured prisoners.
 

avon1985

I just reread this on my Kindle and I got to wondering. Finland is mentioned just a couple of times, once when it surrendered after the landings in France took place and another that the Finnish Jews survived. I also noticed Finnish troops were not mentioned at all. Was Finland given more freedom than any other Axis ally? How did Finland manage so keep Nazi Germany at arms length and get away with it? How big did Finland become after the Russian war and did then keep most of there gains after Germanys final defeat?
 

Lalli

avon1985 said:
I just reread this on my Kindle and I got to wondering. Finland is mentioned just a couple of times, once when it surrendered after the landings in France took place and another that the Finnish Jews survived. I also noticed Finnish troops were not mentioned at all. Was Finland given more freedom than any other Axis ally? How did Finland manage so keep Nazi Germany at arms length and get away with it? How big did Finland become after the Russian war and did then keep most of there gains after Germanys final defeat?
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In OTL Germany never got such influence as it did in many of its puppets. Finland was pretty democratically controlled and there wasn't so much love towards nazis and Finns just ratherly saw alliance with Germany as practical move not some sharing of same ideology. Finland probably had practise similar neutrality policy as it did in OTL during Cold War. About regions I guess that Finland gained whatever between pre-Winter War borders and Greater Finland borders (some push towards Leningrad, OTL Karelian Republic and Kola). IIRC there was stated that after the war Finland was allowed to keep its conquests.
 
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