Wrapped in Flames: The Great American War and Beyond

[Ficboy]

Oh there's definitely scenarios where the Confederates can win without direct foreign intervention like seen here in Wrapped in Flames, but they are certainly few and far between. The Shattered Nation novels do a good job of getting us to an 1864 version of that, and I highly recommend them. Personally I agree with you that an earlier civil war is basically a shoe in for the South to secede as it is far, far less of a disparity between the two sections.

I think Maryland is kind of an exception though. The government in Washington has a huge reason to hang on doggedly to Maryland, if not for strategic reasons than simply for matters of national pride. The Confederates would have to win big for Maryland to ever be on the chopping block at the peace negotiations.

A bit less disparity is the key word here. Also, there are some independent South scenarios that aren't Confederate States-related such as the Federate States of Dixie (FSD) in Oh I Wish I Was In Dixie, the Southern American Confederation (SAC) in Timeline 1828, Dominion of Southern America in the titular timeline and British Columbia in Jefferson's Anti-Slavery Crisis.

 

[EnglishCanuck]

at first i thought i wouldn't like this TL becasue the entire premise hurts but it's very well interesting from what I've read so far and seems to be avoiding cliches of more succesfull south TLs.the UK US emity is kinda of a cliche but its portrayed well here

I'm glad I've managed to make an enjoyable story for you here! Some of it is cliche I know, but I did want to take a crack at this kind of story, and I'm happy it seems to be working out.

.althrough i have to ask is the mexican french war still going on? cause that would mean all of north america is basically screwed.

It is indeed. The butterflies haven't changed quite that much around the world yet, and Napoleon is still looking to get international glory. Some of the changes are outlines in Chapter 43, as well as a general look at the world so far ITTL.

 

[EnglishCanuck]

Chapter 66: The Gates of Heaven​

“Now I hate to tell such a plain truth, but I must -- the bulk of San Francisco's liberality seems sometimes actuated by a love of applause. She don't always take kindly to a good deed for a good deed's sake, but pat her on the head, and flatter her, and say Bully, bully, bully, is the great Metropolis of the Pacific, and she will break her neck trying to accomplish that good deed. You get Dr. Bellows to glorify her princely liberality in ten telegraphic sentences, at forty cents a word, and down they come with $20,000 for the Sanitary Fund! They always respond when 'Glory' calls but they are sometimes slow to respond when they are not going to be applauded.” - Mark Twain, The Dramatic Chronicle, January 16th 1866

"GOD OUR COUNTRY AND LIBERTY. TYRANTS OFFEND THEM" - Flown from the mizzenmast of the USS Essex at the Battle of Valparaíso.

“Since the British landing at Olympia in summer 1862, the war on the Pacific had taken on aspects of a stalemate. Too remote for the Americans to consider retaking, and unable to counter the British power at sea, the war had settled down into a familiar pattern of blockade across the winter of 1862-63, punctuated by the occasional brief skirmish in the woods of the Washington Territory between the opposing pickets.. The Americans, largely content behind their fortifications at San Francisco, while also skirmishing with the Apache, Paiute, and other hostile bands in the south and west, were under no illusions about sortieing out and fighting the British on slopes of the Pacific Northwest

Wright, satisfied he could hold his position and that there was no British army waiting to pounce on San Francisco, would send telegraphs to Washington assuring them that all was well. He would request more supplies, but in return would only receive the news that there was none to send…

In London, there had been discussion of what to do about that Pacific slope. Douglas’s plan of seizing Olympia and points overland had contained merit. However, it was seen as something of a distraction for an entire battalion of infantry. Somerset had been vocal in arguing that the Navy alone could have defended British Columbia, and some in the War Cabinet were inclined to agree with him. With emerging problems with the lords of Japan and the simmering unrest in New Zealand, it might have been argued that the dispatch of British troops on an overseas expedition was a waste of men and material.

The war with America though, took precedence over all other considerations. That San Francisco was the only major port and entrepot on the Pacific Coast (and more importantly, the most advanced anchorage north of Callao) made it a valuable target. Palmerston’s demand for an expanded war merely added incentive for the planners in London to at least consider a strike against it. As much for the benefit of the fleet and another piece at the negotiating table as anything else.

With the seeming inaction and incapability of the American navy after the occupation of Olympia, the British decided that it was high time to do something…” To Arms!: The Great American War, Sheldon Foote, University of Boston 1999.

“For their part the Americans were faced with a number of immediate problems. The terrible flooding over the winter of 1861-62 had bankrupt the state of California with the government unable to pay its own employees, let alone spare funds for emergency spending on defence. There was also the matter of the gold so desperately needed for the war effort; unable to be shipped overseas it now had to be shipped overland and it would be necessary to furbish volunteers to guard these convoys. There was also a conflict between state and federal government over the matter of paying both volunteers and civilian contractors. The common means of exchange had been the use of specie in the economy, but the Federal Government had suspended the use of specie in transactions and civilian contractors refused to take paper money, of which there was precious little to spare in the state to begin with. Announcements that the Army could only pay in government notes had led to walk offs on the construction of batteries and fortifications, so in the immediate aftermath of the outbreak of war precious little work was done on the defences.

Wright correctly assumed that any attack on the Pacific slope would be, by necessity, aimed at San Francisco. With the Mare Island Navy Yard, the Benicia Arsenal, and the gold reserves, it was a natural target. To defend the city four companies of the 9th Infantry Regiment were moved from the North West overland to San Francisco, with some companies of local volunteers replacing them. In San Francisco the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 5th regiments of California Volunteers were concentrated, while the 4th Regiment was posted along the frontier at Fort Yuma. Two further regiments (the 6th and 7th) were being trained and organized through the spring.

Wright for his part was optimistic writing “The General Government has but a small amount of funds at present available for defensive works on this coast, but I apprehend no embarrassment on this account, not for a moment doubting that the loyal and Union-loving people of California will most cheerfully respond to any call which may be made on them, whether for money or men to defend their State from foes without or traitors within.” And this seemed to be true. Governor Leland Stanford’s call for men had produced over 2,000 men under arms to augment the Federal forces in the region, the other governors followed suit and throughout the spring Wright was able to move over 3,000 men to San Francisco. He realized that “In case of war with a maritime nation, the immediate attention of the enemy would most certainly be directed to this city, the great entrepot of our possessions on the Pacific coast.” and as such directed his efforts to the protection of the city. By July he had gathered some 5,000 regulars and militia in entrenchments around the city. Batteries were established at Lime Point and Raccoon Straight, with supporting batteries at Angel and Yerba Buena islands and at Point San Jose. These combined with the guns at Fort Point and Alcatraz brought the total number of guns to 154, covering in basic necessity all the methods of entry through the Golden Gate.

However, these defences were not quite as solid as their builders might have hoped. Training with the 8inch Columbiads on Alcatraz had to be suspended when one exploded seriously damaging a second gun in the process as the artillery commander there, Major Henry S. Burton, feared his guns might be further damaged by repeated firing. Fort Points guns were not all mounted and the supporting earthworks turned out to be the primary supporting batteries as the emplacements to mount guns on the fort itself were not yet complete. The state of the defences were so poor by June that Bell gloomily wrote “The British have amassed a substantial squadron based out of Esquimalt and the French are steadily strengthening their presence off the Mexican Pacific shore. In the present state of the defences of this harbor one half of this force could command the city of San Francisco, and take possession of this yard.”

Bell though, despite his pessimism, he was not lethargic in attempting to expand his force. The great channel of the Golden Gate could not be closed by booms and chains, or blocked by torpedoes, but it could be contested by a dedicated squadron. He had, by December 1862, put together a not unrespectable force. Though the warship Narragansett had been lost in the opening months of the war to a skirmish, he had collected the warships Lancaster(22), Wyoming(6), and Saranac(9) at the harbor alongside the old coastal gunboat Schubrick and Active with two guns each. Then, at not inconsiderable cost, also outfitted the steamships Moses Taylor(4), St. Louis(5), and Hermann(5) as extemporized warships. They had, between them, cost the government upwards of 400,000$ to purchase outright and improve, largely by raiding guns from the old sailing warships Cyane and St. Mary’s for weapons. He had also taken the old hulk of the USS Independence, and fitted her out as a floating battery alongside a pair of other old hulks. Her sisters Warren and Decauter had been deemed incapable of mounting heavy guns however...

...Stuck in the waters of the Bay as they were, Bell was not eager to come to grips with his Royal Navy antagonists. Throughout 1862-63 he largely kept to his waters, and merely responded to British ships coming in close…” - The World on Fire: The Third Anlgo-American War, Ashley Grimes, 2009, Random House Publishing

“Arguments for a scaled up raid were made, largely by Newcastle and the Colonial Office, but Palmerston insisted on an expedition against San Francisco proper. In this he was supported by the Army, but few others. The Admiralty considered a blocking force enough, but the need for a firmer negotiating position seemed it would be necessary to mount some kind of assault, and so the rather tentative compromise was reached. It would be a division sized force supported by the navy which would sail against the Union’s greatest Pacific possession.

Planning went on well into 1862 and early 1863, when the orders went out and the slow process of gathering and shipping these troops was laboriously undertaken. The main strength of the expedition would come from India while a battalion would be detached from New Zealand and Mauritius. The force consisted of six infantry battalions, two from Bengal the 1/6th Regiment of Foot and the 75th, the 83rd From Bombay and the 99th from China. From New Zealand the 65th Regiment of Foot was detached to take part in the expedition as well. Finally, the 24th was detached from Mauritius to bring the force up to a full two brigades. The force also received cavalry support from the 2nd Dragoon Guards from India and artillery from the 14th Brigade Royal Artillery (A and D batteries). The force would also include some 400 sailors and Royal Marines acting as a naval brigade bringing the force to over 5,000 men.

It was to be commanded by Major General Arthur Cunynghame. The fifth son of Col. Sir David Cunynghame, he joined the forces in 1830, purchasing a lieutenancy in the King’s Royal Rifles. He served in the First Opium War as aide-de-camp to Major-General Alexander Fraser, Lord Saltoun, and was present at the Battle of Chinkiang. In 1845, he was promoted to Major and in November 1846 he was appointed Lieutenant-Colonel of the 13th Light Infantry. Within a month he transferred as Lieutenant-Colonel in the Grenadier Guards. He joined the 20th Regiment in 1849 and the 27th Regiment in 1852. In 1853–54, he served as aide-de-camp to his father-in-law, Commander-in-Chief of the Forces Viscount Hardinge, until returning to action in the Crimean War. In 1854, Cunynghame served as Assistant Quartermaster-General to the first division, and was present at Bulganac and the battles of the Alma, Balaclava, Inkerman, Chernaya, and at the Siege of Sevastopol, receiving numerous mentions in the dispatches.

In 1855 he was given the local rank of Major General and he took command of 10,000 Ottoman troops to occupy Kerch and cut off the final overland supply route to Sevastopol and maintained the position over the winter. He commanded an Infantry Brigade at Dublin from 1856–60, and was promoted to Major General in 1861. Leaving for India, he commanded forces at Bombay to 1863 before being chosen for the California Expedition by the War Office. He joined his forces at Honolulu.

The Pacific Division was formally organized in June 1863. It’s organization was as such:

Commanding the Division: MG Arthur Cunyngham

ADC: Lt. B. L. Foster, RA

Chief of the Staff: Lt. Col Robert Carey, 40th Foot

Deputy Adjutant General: Captain William V. Munnings, 24th Foot

Quartermaster General: (bvt.) Major F.G. Warren, Bengal Artillery

1st Brigade (Col. Augustus H. Ferryman, 75th Foot) 83rd Regiment of Foot, 75th Regiment of Foot, 1/6th Regiment of Foot

2nd Brigade (Col. Charles H. Ellice, 24th Foot) 99th Regiment of Foot (4 cos), 65th Regiment of Foot, 24th Regiment of Foot

2nd Dragoon Guards (Lt. Col. William H. Seymour)

14th Field Brigade Royal Artillery(A and D batteries)(Lt. Col. Peter P. Faddy)

Support Troops:

21st Company, Royal Engineers, Naval Brigade, Royal Navy Artillery

The main force set out from India with the transports HMS Adventure and HMS Urgent each carrying a battalion and local shipping pressed into service to carry another as well as the cavalry and artillery under escort from HMS Alert. The convoys met at Honolulu where they took the forces from New Zealand under their wing where they would shepherd them to British Columbia.” – Empire and Blood: British Military Operations in the 19th Century Volume IV

Sir Arthur Cunynghame​

“The Kingdom of Hawaii was in 1860, in a state of flux. Though the islanders at this point still outnumbered the American settlers their population was decreasing almost yearly thanks to foreign diseases. Kamehameha IV was well aware of this fact and sought to attempt to limit the influence of the American settlers and missionaries on the island....

The King had long had an anti-American sentiment ever since his travels as a teenager. In his travels he had visited the nations of Europe and on the return trip travelled across America. There he experienced unbridled racism even in spite of his royal status which caused him great consternation. Writing after his trip recalling one such experience he said "I found he was the conductor, and took me for somebody's servant just because I had a darker skin than he had. Confounded fool;[this is] the first time that I have ever received such treatment, not in England or France or anywhere else...in England an African can pay his fare and sit alongside Queen Victoria. The Americans talk and think a great deal about their liberty, and strangers often find that too many liberties are taken of their comfort just because his hosts are a free people." Alexander’s anti-American feelings were well known amongst the populace, and as such the American settlers on the island had in 1856 attempted to organize to get an annexation treaty signed but had failed in doing so.

This had only further increased his distrust of the American population of the islands. He sought to limit his dependence on the United States by seeking out ties with other foreign nations, especially Britain. It was at first in small ways that the king sought to curry favor with the British, extending preferable trade rights to British merchants, and by encouraging Anglican settlers to the islands, even writing to England to summon an Anglican bishop to come in order to facilitate the growth of the British settler population.

The arrival of the British fleet in 1863 however, caused great consideration...

Though these British warships and British soldiers were only pausing to take on supplies and allow the men to stretch their legs and pursue various venereal diseases while they waited for the remainder of the fleet, but the American settlers on the island saw it as the first step to British annexation. The king however saw it in a different light. This overt show of strength made him thoughtful and he saw an excellent opportunity to rid himself of the American threat once and for all.

The American commissioner to the kingdom, Thomas Dryer, complained bitterly of the British presence, formally requesting the king demand they move on. He pointed out that the kingdom had already declared neutrality in the war between the Federal government and the rebellious states, and that as a neutral he was honor bound to throw the British out. The king ignored this protestation, even then glancing on the assembled warships and transports with undisguised interest…” - The House of Kamehameha, Brandon Somers, Oxford Press, 1987

King Kamehameha IV​

“The American forces in California had grown by the summer of 1863, largely through their own resources. The arsenals had been raided and weapons distributed amongst the new volunteers and militia companies. This had allowed a strong force to be assembled in San Francisco proper.

With the dispatch of the 6th to the frontier to guard the lines of communications, the overland routes, and the Nevada mines, the troops in the city were organized into two brigades. The 1st Brigade was under the command of Colonel Caleb Sibley of the 9th Infantry Regiment commanded the field brigade of the 1st, 2nd and 5th California Volunteer Infantry, while Colonel James H. Carleton commanded the second brigade composed of the 3rd and 7th California Volunteer Infantry and a composite battalion of local militia. Four companies of the 9th Infantry Regiment acted as garrisons at the fortifications alongside some 1,600 men enrolled as gunners with the fortifications. Attached to each brigade were squadrons from the 1st and 2nd California Cavalry Regiments, who had half their strength in San Francisco, and the rest scattered at various postings.

All told, this gave the garrison some 6,000 men to defend the city…

The most exciting event for the garrison in March 1863 was the capture of the attempted pirate vessel the schooner Chapman. Having been purchased by the Confederate sympathizer Asbury Harpending, he had been recruiting Southern sympathetic men to first offer the ship as an auxiliary to the US navy, but then sail to the British blockaders in an attempt to sell their secrets to the Royal Navy. While Harpending did succeed in purchasing the Chapman, his planned betrayal fell apart when a member of the garrison overheard one of the conspirators boldly proclaiming he was to ‘go pirate for the South’ and informed Col. Sibley. So when the crew of the Chapman prepared to sail in March, they were instead arrested and interned in Alcatraz.” – Empire and Blood: British Military Operations in the 19th Century Volume IV

Colonel James H. Carleton​

“…by the end of June the expedition had arrived in British Columbia and the men and animals were given a few weeks to rest and regain their land legs after a long voyage and the brief stopover in Hawaii. Cunynghame took command and organized his forces while preparing to leave as soon as his men were rested.

The plan was, in accordance with information provided by the navy, to seize Fort Point on the outer edges of the city's defences, and thereby open the Golden Gate to the fleet to proceed unmolested to either engage or bottle up the American squadron. The land defences being made untenable, it was assumed the city would have no choice but to capitulate...

...on August 27th the British appeared off the coast at Golden Gate. The appearance of British warships near the bay was not unusual, Maitland had previously tested the defences in short forays against the outer batteries and so the appearance of British warships did not cause much alarm at first. As the size of the fleet became evident and the transports peeled away general alarm set in and the defenses were mobilized in earnest.

Maitland brought his ships steaming through the bay firing as they came. In the lead was Tartar, with Maitland’s larger frigates and his flagship, the mighty Waterloo, the two remaining corvettes following, and the gunboats taking up the rear. The transports angled away from the fleet heading towards the sandy beaches at Land’s End where the expeditionary force began landing in good order unopposed save for occasional gunfire from skirmishers from the fort.

Though the landings got off to a good start with the infantry and cavalry landing in good order, they struggled to bring the artillery ashore, especially the heavier muzzle loading pieces and the naval artillery with the Naval Brigade, and although they made good time in the morning, under the soft sands the artillery became difficult to move up hill.

Cunynghame had come ashore with the first boats, overseeing the placement of his division and sorting them landing troops into formations. The first brigade under Ferryham was already in position by noon, with the cavalry not far behind. Worrying about a sortie from the defenders, Cunynghame determined to march without his full second brigade. He would advance inland against Fort Point while Maitland’s squadron would bombard the position from the sea.

The infantry and cavalry advanced in a staggered order with skirmishers leading behind the cavalry up the narrow roads from the beach. They did manage to reach the earthworks defending the landward side of the fort by 1pm however, the artillery was still being escorted to this position. The British made the best of it gathering into a battle line, when the American forces, the First Brigade, under Sibley marched from the entrenchments of San Francisco to meet them. Wright reasoned his only chance was to drive the British back to their boats before they could set up a proper siege...

The Dragoons and Sibley’s cavalry skirmished repeatedly giving the British time to prepare...

In the opening stages of the fight the two sides met with roughly equal numbers (some 3,000 each) as the remainder of the division moved to land. The opening skirmishing heavily favored the British who opened fire from 300 yards as the blue coated infantry marched into battle across the dunes. It was in the opening skirmishing that Sibley was killed, decapitating the command of the mixed force of regulars and militia. In the confusion his second in command was also slain and the blue coated infantry milled about unsure of its orders. As the 24th arrived from the shore, the weight of fire soon sent the American Volunteers retreating towards the defences of the city. The cavalry prevented a close pursuit and the British instead turned their attention to Fort Point...

In the Bay Maitland’s squadron steamed past the guns of the supporting batteries and opened fire on Fort Point. Maitland, a gunnery expert, had his squadron drilled extremely well and the British fire was murderously effective. On the American side, though they had the range, the reverse was true. The gunnery from Alcatraz was poor causing gaining more misses than hits, and true to the fears of her commanding officer the stress of repeated firing caused two more Columbiads to burst killing two men and wounding several others. The gunnery from Fort Point was somewhat better, managing a number of hits on Maitland’s squadron, but they were no match to the skill of the Royal Navy who pelted the fortifications with shot.

Bell’s squadron then intervened in an attempt to save the fortifications, and by 3pm the action had become a general engagement. In the melee that followed Bell himself was killed as Lancaster was pounded by the big frigates, Clio had run to ground and was burning and Topaze was severely damaged, losing several of her guns. However, the outcome was never seriously in doubt, the skilled gunnery of the Royal Navy and the overwhelming advantage in guns they possessed over their foes meant that Bell’s squadron was either forced to strike, or flee to the second line of defence near the city proper. Maitland’s squadron cruised past and were able to silence the second line batteries and placed the city under his guns and demanded its surrender.

At Fort Point the British infantry and Naval Brigade had settled in and were bombarding the incomplete fortifications, drawing away the defenders from the naval action to the defense of their own fortification...

With no fleet to speak of, his ground forces in disarray, and the city under the guns of the Royal Navy, Wright was forced to enter into negotiations with Maitland. It was agreed that the garrisons of Fort Point and Alcatraz would be surrendered, while the infantry, cavalry, and artillery within the city would be allowed to withdraw to Sacramento (Cunynghame and Maitland lacking the numbers to compel the surrender of the trenches without bombardment and Wright was unwilling to surrender his entire force) with their arms. The city was surrendered in a solemn ceremony aboard Bacchante on the 30th, with both Maitland and Cunynghame in attendance as both Wright and the mayor, Henry F. Teschemacher, formally surrendered the city to the enemy.

Wright’s forces withdrew from the city in good order the next morning, watched over by British troops who were soon occupying the earthworks the Americans had abandoned. On land Wright had lost some 1,300 men wounded, killed, and captured with the complete capture of the US Pacific Squadron, save for those cruisers still at large on the seas. Cunynghame and his expedition had lost 900 wounded and killed in the fighting while Maitland had lost some 200 at sea. Through that though he had now erased the threat of more cruisers floating across the Pacific and had seized the one great outpost on the US West Coast as well as the US Mint.

However, he was in no position to threaten the rest of the state, and although Cunynghame recommended a raid against Sacramento once the temporary truce ended Maitland felt that inland operations could not be considered. There was no immediate source of reinforcement available to him, and with the British needs expanding across the Pacific rather than shrinking it was unlikely they would receive support for some time. As such they began occupying the positions the Americans had vacated, and settled in to repulse the expected American counterattack.

For the Americans part, they set about gathering the strength to retake the city, or at least bottle up the British forces there.... ” - A World on Fire: The Third Anglo-American War, Ashely Ledger, Random House, 2010

 

[Icedaemon]

How did I miss the previous story post?

The meeting which took place in Fort Garry remains to this day a subject of vicious debate between historians and the people of the province. As few present were left to witness the agreement made in the aftermath (and many would say Macdonald went to great lengths to hide any evidence of it) the exact terms of the agreement are unknown, and after the events of 1870 will likely remain forever shrouded in controversy…

What can be firmly established is this, Mactavish approached the Assembly and asked if it would be in the power of the Métis people to help defend the colony. Riel confirmed that this was true, and in line with general Métis sentiment. However, what the Métis wanted was a stake in the running of the settlement in return. In exchange, they proposed that the land title of all Metis in the settlement, or the area around it, be recognized. Mactavish would later say he only approved of the first condition, and happily granted them a say in running the settlement…” - From Selkirk to Hysperia: The History of the Red River Settlement, Samuel J. Sullivan, Wolseley, 1992

“When Mactavish approached the Assembly, he practically begged the leaders there for their aid in defending the Settlement. Seeing that this was a matter involving all of the peoples of the Red River, the Métis agreed, but only if their conditions were met. Riel laid out that they would accept this responsibility on the condition that the land title of the Metis be respected, and that they get a say in running the Red River settlement alongside the Church. Mactavish eagerly agreed to these points, and the agreement was witnessed and signed in late June of 1863…” - The Northwest Is Our Mother: The Métis Nation, Jean Tache, Fort Garry Press, 2011

This is after the Peninsular war, so the term Guerilla already exists. Nice to see the Métis fighting smart.

The expedition set out to cover the 71 miles between Pembina and Fort Garry on the 7th. It was 71 miles of hills, coulees, river beds, and prairie which the Métis knew intimately. After a modest march of six miles through wild and hilly country, they made camp for the night. That night, a group of Métis under Dumont, snuck in and killed two guards before stampeding the cattle. There was much confusion, loss of horses, and destruction of property before the situation was under control, and before the night was out the Métis had killed five more men before galloping off for the loss of none of their own.

Sibley ordered Hatch’s cavalry to the flanks, and constant skirmish was the result. By the second day the column had only moved eight nine miles and lost fifteen men dead or wounded. They arrived at the Letellier Coule and prepared to camp. That night they were left alone, but in the morning a skirmish broke out. 300 Metis had dug rifle pits, and used their carts as cover, along the hills of the coulee. They opened a murderous fire on the American camp, killing horses, men, and teamsters. By the time Lt. Darling had unlimbered his guns the Métis were gone. Sibley issued orders that the column would stand to every morning…

Another week of murderous skirmishing would follow, men lost in small pointless skirmishes. The Métis ambushing them from cover. Whenever the men would form a skirmish line to engage the Métis would fight them for a time, but then simply fall back. The guns brought forward were used ineffectually to blast after their assailants…

This massive victory against twice their number should really buy the Métis enough accolades to genuinely get the rights they ask for, unless someone in Canada's administation is really against them. By this time, the British had already formulated the 'martial races' idea which they applied to their subjects, so making use of the Metis as a population of dedicated hunters, trackers and professional special forces is not inconceivable.

 

[ThunderBolt47]

Interesting, I thought the British were overextending and was expecting them make a hard go of it but ultimately lose and retreat. Then instead the British would have gone to capture Hawaii which I thought would be more manageable for them logistically.

My worry now is that while capturing San Francisco is a big boon, the British may have spread themselves too thin between New Zealand, San Francisco and Olympia and possibly Hawaii to consider as well.

 

[EnglishCanuck]

As something of a postscript to this chapter, I do want to stress that, other than the British invasion, I'm not actually making much up here. Bell did indeed write his quote in 1862 that he felt half the British Pacific Squadron could seize control of the yard, the Columbiads on Aclatraz did indeed explode during practice firing, King Kamehameha wrote exactly what he did and did harbor latent anti-American feelings, and bizarrely enough, the case of Asbury Harpending and the Chapman is a true story. The Pacific was largely cut off from the rest of the United States until the Transcontinental Railroad was built in OTL, and so it was a very isolated location taking weeks to months to reach overland.

This has changed a lot from my original vision of a quick British invasion in 1862, but the final outcome is, I believe, fairly representative of what would happen. The biggest problem the British face is time and distance, and it would indeed take time to assemble the force I describe, but it is also one which probably would have won out. Their advantage is that they can call on forces from the India garrison and those forces in New Zealand, China and Africa (there were two battalions in Mauritius, and another four in South Africa I've left alone) which could, over time, be developed as a fairly potent expeditionary force. The one major advantage they have is that this isn't an army of conquest, it's to take something the British can use to force the US to the table.

 

[EnglishCanuck]

This is after the Peninsular war, so the term Guerilla already exists. Nice to see the Métis fighting smart.

The Métis method of war, as far as I can tell, is very different from the European one. They much preferred to fight on the defensive or in smaller skirmishes to weaken their enemies and then draw them into prepared positions with as little risk to themselves as possible. I did some research on Métis fighting, and it seems that at places like Grand Coteau, and across the Northwest Rebellion, their mobility and their ability to dig in was what helped them win. Here several hundred well organized Métis under a respected leader having a merry go at an American column largely ignorant of the terrain and their enemy seems to have but one reasonable outcome.

This massive victory against twice their number should really buy the Métis enough accolades to genuinely get the rights they ask for, unless someone in Canada's administation is really against them. By this time, the British had already formulated the 'martial races' idea which they applied to their subjects, so making use of the Metis as a population of dedicated hunters, trackers and professional special forces is not inconceivable.

It should, but I tried to give a snapshot of the pre-war politics in the Red River as a bit of a teaser. Schultz and his Canadian Party won't just be going away after all (and Schultz is going to really want to have the stain of grounding the Northrup removed), and the racist sentiment of 'half breeds' is going to stick. You'll have some people living there who respect them for saving the colony, but what about the next wave of settlers who don't know the war? It's also quite arguable that Mactavish's agreement with the Métis is null compared to whatever deal the Hudson's Bay Company works out with any future Canada.

The politics post-war and into the 1860s out west are going to be more, interesting than they were OTL.

 

[EnglishCanuck]

Interesting, I thought the British were overextending and was expecting them make a hard go of it but ultimately lose and retreat. Then instead the British would have gone to capture Hawaii which I thought would be more manageable for them logistically.

My worry now is that while capturing San Francisco is a big boon, the British may have spread themselves too thin between New Zealand, San Francisco and Olympia and possibly Hawaii to consider as well.

Oh they are arguably over-extended. Only half the 99th was able to participate in the landing (offset somewhat by the presence of the Naval Brigade) and they do still have to both garrison points in Washington Territory, San Francisco, British Columbia, and attend their existing commitments in New Zealand and potentially Japan.

China is a little bit less of a problem as both historically the Taiping were not looking to attack Shanghai, and the British officials there were more than willing to let the Ever Victorious Army and the other various European mercenaries (and the French) handle the grunt work while they had the navy control the rivers. The China situation is also going to be calming down more across 1863 as the Taiping have hit their high point.

Hawaii remains an interesting place. This war will definitely see the British realize the utility of the place, and couple that with an avowedly anti-American king whose son's adoptive godmother is Queen Victoria and you have some interesting ramifications...

 

[The Gunslinger]

I'm kind of with the navy on this one. Once you've blockaded San Francisco there really isn't any point in conquering the city unless you're going to push inland and go for that sweet California gold. They should have shored up the Canadian border to give them a better bargaining chip for the peace treaty.

With the British in control of the city is there anything happening with Confederate sympathizers? I can't imagine much would come of it, but now they've at least got a base of operations in California free from Union authority.

 

[EnglishCanuck]

I'm kind of with the navy on this one. Once you've blockaded San Francisco there really isn't any point in conquering the city unless you're going to push inland and go for that sweet California gold. They should have shored up the Canadian border to give them a better bargaining chip for the peace treaty.

The more research I've done on TTL the more I've realized that the navy had a lot of good points about any possible Anglo-American war in the 19th century. It just simply wouldn't do to let the army or the cabinet know that of course!

Unfortunately though, the thinkers in London were more thinking of ending the commerce raids and making a big statement. Capturing San Francisco does that, but doesn't really make any big Border changes. Much to Douglass's chagrin.

With the British in control of the city is there anything happening with Confederate sympathizers? I can't imagine much would come of it, but now they've at least got a base of operations in California free from Union authority.

I've definitely given that some thought! The British do need some light cavalry and maybe people who know the land. There were a couple hundred locked up in Alcatraz historically, so I'm betting more than a handful would be angry enough to try and get some payback. I've got a guy in mind.

 

[VANRIDERFAN]

The Métis method of war, as far as I can tell, is very different from the European one. They much preferred to fight on the defensive or in smaller skirmishes to weaken their enemies and then draw them into prepared positions with as little risk to themselves as possible. I did some research on Métis fighting, and it seems that at places like Grand Coteau, and across the Northwest Rebellion, their mobility and their ability to dig in was what helped them win. Here several hundred well organized Métis under a respected leader having a merry go at an American column largely ignorant of the terrain and their enemy seems to have but one reasonable outcome.



It should, but I tried to give a snapshot of the pre-war politics in the Red River as a bit of a teaser. Schultz and his Canadian Party won't just be going away after all (and Schultz is going to really want to have the stain of grounding the Northrup removed), and the racist sentiment of 'half breeds' is going to stick. You'll have some people living there who respect them for saving the colony, but what about the next wave of settlers who don't know the war? It's also quite arguable that Mactavish's agreement with the Métis is null compared to whatever deal the Hudson's Bay Company works out with any future Canada.

The politics post-war and into the 1860s out west are going to be more, interesting than they were OTL.

As a ex-pat Manitoban I was taught in school that Riel was a traitor and got what he deserved in 1888. Over time I have realized that it was the Orangemen from Ontario who were the cause of all things that went south for the Metis. Hoping against hope that there is a different outcome for the Metis (and the Prairies as a whole). If the UK is victorious, I'd push for for the border on the plains being pushed south to include Duluth and the 46th Parallel west to the Columbia and have the Columbia as the southern border in the Oregon territory.

 

[EnglishCanuck]

As a ex-pat Manitoban I was taught in school that Riel was a traitor and got what he deserved in 1888. Over time I have realized that it was the Orangemen from Ontario who were the cause of all things that went south for the Metis. Hoping against hope that there is a different outcome for the Metis (and the Prairies as a whole). If the UK is victorious, I'd push for for the border on the plains being pushed south to include Duluth and the 46th Parallel west to the Columbia and have the Columbia as the southern border in the Oregon territory.

Riel is really one of the most well known tragic figures in Canadian history. He was wrongly maligned for 'rebellion' in 1870, fled to exile because he was held responsible for the murder of Thomas Scott, and then when he really did lead a rebellion in 1885, his trial was basically revenge for the government not catching him 15 years earlier. There's going to be some differences for the Metis people I can guarantee that, but let's just say that whether they eventually fall under the power of Ottawa or Washington, neither capital is going to have their best interests at heart.

There are definitely advocates who are pushing for a more southerly border on the plains (Douglas in BC is one of them, and George Brown is having similar visions in Quebec) but there's still a lot of empty space between the main theaters of the war and the sparsely settled prairies.

 

[The Gunslinger]

As a ex-pat Manitoban I was taught in school that Riel was a traitor and got what he deserved in 1888. Over time I have realized that it was the Orangemen from Ontario who were the cause of all things that went south for the Metis.

That's a very simplistic view of what happened. The Orangemen were anti-Metis, but the bulk of the Metis problems can be laid firmly at the feet of Riel and the federal government. The government was slow to act and extremely disinterested in Metis land claims and Riel made huge promises to the Metis people that he had 0% chance being able to keep. After the murder of Thomas Scott the Metis, and especially Riel, were firmly in federal crosshairs and the Canadian government was deeply suspicious of anything he was involved in.

 

[VANRIDERFAN]

That's a very simplistic view of what happened. The Orangemen were anti-Metis, but the bulk of the Metis problems can be laid firmly at the feet of Riel and the federal government. The government was slow to act and extremely disinterested in Metis land claims and Riel made huge promises to the Metis people that he had 0% chance being able to keep. After the murder of Thomas Scott the Metis, and especially Riel, were firmly in federal crosshairs and the Canadian government was deeply suspicious of anything he was involved in.

Riel had pretty significant mental issues which didn't help things at all.
Thomas Scott was an agitator who had every chance to leave the region with his neck attached.
Lots of blame to go around and maybe we wouldn't be in the mess we're in today if we had just allowed the Metis to continue their ways after 1870. In hindsight there was plenty land to go around.

 

[DAv]

Been neglecting this for too long and seems like I've come back at a dramatic spot. San Francisco is quite the prize to have, although I can't imagine the CSA is impressed that the UK is neglecting the main front for side-prizes to be used as negotiating tools. Has the Confederate leadership had any major wake up calls as to the British intentions in regards to their war aims?

 

[Icedaemon]

This had only further increased his distrust of the American population of the islands. He sought to limit his dependence on the United States by seeking out ties with other foreign nations, especially Britain. It was at first in small ways that the king sought to curry favor with the British, extending preferable trade rights to British merchants, and by encouraging Anglican settlers to the islands, even writing to England to summon an Anglican bishop to come in order to facilitate the growth of the British settler population.

The arrival of the British fleet in 1863 however, caused great consideration...

Though these British warships and British soldiers were only pausing to take on supplies and allow the men to stretch their legs and pursue various venereal diseases while they waited for the remainder of the fleet, but the American settlers on the island saw it as the first step to British annexation. The king however saw it in a different light. This overt show of strength made him thoughtful and he saw an excellent opportunity to rid himself of the American threat once and for all.

The American commissioner to the kingdom, Thomas Dryer, complained bitterly of the British presence, formally requesting the king demand they move on. He pointed out that the kingdom had already declared neutrality in the war between the Federal government and the rebellious states, and that as a neutral he was honor bound to throw the British out. The king ignored this protestation, even then glancing on the assembled warships and transports with undisguised interest…” - The House of Kamehameha, Brandon Somers, Oxford Press, 1987

I take it there's going to be an independent kingdom of Hawaii that's still around in the 20th century of this timeline?

I've definitely given that some thought! The British do need some light cavalry and maybe people who know the land. There were a couple hundred locked up in Alcatraz historically, so I'm betting more than a handful would be angry enough to try and get some payback. I've got a guy in mind.

Since it was stated previously that San Francisco was skirmishing with natives still, can the British perhaps try to strike a deal with some of them? Provide some newly captured arms to the Apache and/or Shoshone, with the latter also potentially given the option of guaranteed land rights in the Oregon territory if the British get the Union's bits thereof. That, in exchange for scouts and skirmishers or simply for independently harassing the yankees while leaving any British forays into the interior unmolested. Afterwards, they are a deniable asset if things go poorly.

 

[EnglishCanuck]

Been neglecting this for too long and seems like I've come back at a dramatic spot. San Francisco is quite the prize to have, although I can't imagine the CSA is impressed that the UK is neglecting the main front for side-prizes to be used as negotiating tools. Has the Confederate leadership had any major wake up calls as to the British intentions in regards to their war aims?

From the Confederate perspective, watching the British invasion from the North coupled with the blockade and the help with the attack on Washington, is all the proof they need that the British are helping them gain their independence. They were ticked off back in 1862 when it seemed like the British were fighting a separate war, but now that they seem to be directly engaging in helping bring the US down with their fleet and a brigade of Royal Marines garrisoning Annapolis, they see it as only a matter of time before the British recognize them.

Truthfully the fall of Washington would probably do that. The British want it to succeed as they see it as essentially ending the war. It's probably the major area of Anglo-Confederate agreement.

 

[EnglishCanuck]

I take it there's going to be an independent kingdom of Hawaii that's still around in the 20th century of this timeline?

Well there's still 40 years left in the 19th century, but let's just say I don't see Hawaii having such an obvious trajectory as OTL in a situation where the British have just ended American naval power in the Pacific in an afternoon...

However, there's some major problems with the Royal Family which need resolving.

Since it was stated previously that San Francisco was skirmishing with natives still, can the British perhaps try to strike a deal with some of them? Provide some newly captured arms to the Apache and/or Shoshone, with the latter also potentially given the option of guaranteed land rights in the Oregon territory if the British get the Union's bits thereof. That, in exchange for scouts and skirmishers or simply for independently harassing the yankees while leaving any British forays into the interior unmolested. Afterwards, they are a deniable asset if things go poorly.

Currently the British only control points north around the border with British Columbia and slivers of the Washington Territory which amount to the Rosario Straights, the Olympic Peninsula, and de-facto the settlements along the shores of the Puget Sound, and then San Francisco. It would take, currently, a lot of effort to get another major expedition into the interior, and would require detaching forces from San Franciso which may or may not be worth it. Supplying the Apache or Shoshone with arms or giving them promises of land doesn't really benefit the British at the moment.

While they could try something like that in the future, the idea doesn't really have broad appeal with the Colonial Office or the India Office. Then the British really don't know much about the conditions on the ground with the Native peoples as well. The only armed Native peoples currently in British service are companies of Six Nations peoples and Mohawk in Canada West and Canada East.

 

[Deckhand]

While they could try something like that in the future, the idea doesn't really have broad appeal with the Colonial Office or the India Office. Then the British really don't know much about the conditions on the ground with the Native peoples as well. The only armed Native peoples currently in British service are companies of Six Nations peoples and Mohawk in Canada West and Canada East.

This may be true about the Plains nations, but the HBC was the principal trading post for the northwest nations until the finalization of the Oregon border, and Douglas and his agents will still know most of the chiefs, so their intel in Oregon and Washington should be decent. Also the Yakima war finally ran down in 1858, and the Cayuse in 1859. So a large group of the nations were just put down within the last 5 years. But the regular regiments with artillery that did it are not there any more. OTL there was not any significant rising during the civil war, but ITTL the entire military support structure for white settlers has just been taken over by the first nation's old friends. I would think all it would take is Douglas to raise his hand in the air and several thousand Natives will rally to clean house. Even if Britain does not encourage it, and make any promises, i think that absent the US Military, some few of the more angry natives may start some incidents. If it happens it may grow and the British might find themselves in the police position as they try to keep things calm.

 

[EnglishCanuck]

This may be true about the Plains nations, but the HBC was the principal trading post for the northwest nations until the finalization of the Oregon border, and Douglas and his agents will still know most of the chiefs, so their intel in Oregon and Washington should be decent. Also the Yakima war finally ran down in 1858, and the Cayuse in 1859. So a large group of the nations were just put down within the last 5 years. But the regular regiments with artillery that did it are not there any more. OTL there was not any significant rising during the civil war, but ITTL the entire military support structure for white settlers has just been taken over by the first nation's old friends. I would think all it would take is Douglas to raise his hand in the air and several thousand Natives will rally to clean house. Even if Britain does not encourage it, and make any promises, i think that absent the US Military, some few of the more angry natives may start some incidents. If it happens it may grow and the British might find themselves in the police position as they try to keep things calm.

Hmm that is an interesting point. I suppose I couldn't put it past Douglas to make some overtures which might force the hand of the politicians in London. Though that would be one more example of overall 'mission creep' in a war that has already seen a lot of it.

Though for clarity, there's still a few companies of regular US troops in the north supplemented by militia, but definitely not enough to truly keep a lid on things. The Snake War may start a little earlier for example, and the Owen's Valley War and the Bald Hills War is still raging onwards, but with fewer California troops to keep things under wraps. Though the American forces might instead try to divert attention to those rather than an all out attack on San Francisco which is probably doomed to failure.